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IPC Section 498-A: Misuse

Dedicated to the Victimised Indian Families, Who are falsely threatened & Blackmailed by the Indian Daughters-In-Law & her family members, and those Victimised families who are already falsely charged under the Section 498A. Its all about False charges of Dowry Law, Domestic Violence, Alimony, Marriage and Divorce. NOTE: All articles are my personal copyright. They may be republished if the source is acknowledged and a link provided to this site. This is not an Anti-Women Blog. Read Disclaimer.

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Location: Mumbai, Maharashtra, India

Women go to the police with a complaint (may be false), but the system provides to record that as a criminal complaint and that data adds in to the National Statistics of Crime Against Women. When male goes with a genuine complaint the police at max can record a Non Cognizable offence against the women. That will never reflect in the statistics. Then how will one guage crime against men? Every 100 Suicides in India have 63 Males and 37 Females. Every 100 male suicides have 45 married males, and every 100 women suicides have 25 married Women. Married women suicides have default arrests of the inlaws under presumed dowry death. Married men suicides entitle wife for a 50% share in property. What kind of equality is this? I thank you for visiting my blog, Please visit again. And I welcome you to participate on my Blog. [indianhusbands (at-the-rate) yahoo (dot) com]. Click here for Main Page

Friday, April 06, 2007

Mental Cruelty: Defining a Moot Point.

While My Defination of Indian LAW** (** Indian Lady Always Wins) still largely prevails in the lower courts but Supreme Court is giving sensible unbiased judgments (but still the damage is already done in all the cases). Even some High Court Judgments of Justice J D Kapoor and Justice Dhingra are worth an applause.

Case of Appasaheb was worth giving a 2nd look, which is never done if the accused is a male. Asking for emergency local expenses from wife was finally declared as NOT Dowry. This was upheld by the Apex Court. Further, Pinky Anand had impressed the victims with her argument during the DV Act Media Debate that it is indeed ok for a wife to help her husband and it is ok for a husband to ask for money from wife for local expense in this gender equality era. There are some guys who correctly argue that what is the fun in marriage where one is at the mercy of interpretation of the other partner. Contribution from both the partners has to come from some way or the other.

Mental Cruelty is a very relative definition, it is like defining a moot point. Einstein had described theory of relativity to a teenager as putting your hand for one long minute in a fire v/s holding a hand of a beautiful girl for just one day. Similarly it is very difficult to say what is not mental cruelty and moreover guys are equally vulnerable to it as human beings.

What is clearly hated by the Indian Junta is the fact the attitude of some individuals who claim to represent Women Liberation Movement in India by virtue of their association with some national bodies of women welfare that speaks as if Mental cruelty is a product and Indian Women have the monopoly to define it, by the way Indian Males do not require any law for their protection is what they say. Gurdarshan a Volunteer of Save Indian Family Movement and a Director of Save Family Foundation asked one of the basic fundamental question that even this blog has been asking “What law is there to protect Indian Husband or any of his relatives?” and Ms.Ranjana Kumari bluntly answered there is no Law required. Madams we are all watching you all. And we know what we want.

Further since there is no law for Indian husbands and his parents how can there be statistics available? Treating law like a cosmetic-for-ladies-not-available-for-men is not fair. As if quacks announcing that medicines are required only for females and not males as they cannot fall sick being strong. One can’t become taller by cutting the other short. Remember NCW’s answer to Indian Govt? An adulterous woman is a victim and hence cannot be punished, let the law be reviewed and the crime should be made civil. They have it all, from a modesty law to 498a to the great DV Act.

There is still a long way to go: After calling Misuse of 498a as Legal Terrorism, SC has defined Mental Cruelty, it means till date the definition was not as clear. And though I would call it as a great gesture to attempt a definition, but still I see a room for improvement, as half defined laws are like Glass Half Full which may be interpreted as Glass Half Empty. Samar Ghosh’s 69 page verdict was defined where for 17 years the lady refused to cohabit with her husband and other side we have laws like Maritial Rape.

In other words there have been cases where constructive cruelty is attempted. Where the so called victim has worked her way to circumstances that lead the opposite party to frustration. What is argued as indifference may actually be intended to do so to frustrate the opposite party. What seems as a cruelty by language may be actually worked upon to provoke a Zidane to get him a legal red card. As usual I am concerned about the misuse.

Some Arguments still unanswered: If DV Act was for Rural Women, why have Live In Relationships been included In that act? Is that a Rural Lifestyle? The justification is the majority of women (70%) are in rural areas.
Similarly if laws are made for rural women at large, if “not cooking” by wife was defined as mental cruelty, there should be no opposition by feminists on the theory of also working and cooking for women as that largely happens only in urban areas, otherwise as per their definition women are at home . This is purely by their arguments.

I would say, when marriage is mutual so has to be divorce. While some benches in Indian courts seem to take mature decisions (like the one on irreconcilable differences), it also takes maturity for both the parties to decide their bond for future. It is better to part mutually, with no nuisance to the society and courts rather than letting a 3rd party decide at 3 levels (Lower, High and Supreme Courts, with moot points and one sided laws) as to who is right and who is wrong. Well its all said and done there is a problem else there would not have been this day. It is better to mutually call it off.

But on the positive side, thank You Supreme Court for not being mute on this moot point. Now the Indian male before hopelessly committing suicide *may* contest his case in the Supreme Court.

24 Comments:

Anonymous malarvannan said...

This blog is very relevant and reflects exactly the present day scenario. "Feminism" is taking a bigger toll in the present day world and I predict a world war between feminists and their victims in the near future.

Sat Apr 07, 02:37:00 AM GMT+5:30  
Anonymous Rakesh Sheth said...

Jinesh
extermelly well written article , the whole issue is what accounts to mental cruelity is still very vague, this definations need to be changed from time to time but that does not seem to happen. constant suspiccion on husband is that not a cruelity of husband ? however the indian law maker(the 540 joker) does not beleive that mental cruelity can happen both to men and women?
it took 17 years for a case to close was that not cruelity and still the women walks aways scott free

that's my india Amen

Rakesh

Sat Apr 07, 03:47:00 PM GMT+5:30  
Blogger Rebel said...

Humans are conditioned for centuries to believe that a man is much stronger and women are less stronger, so it is men's responsibility to protect and provide women. This outdated perception should have been scrapped since in today's world, one needs education, soft skills, and experience and not physical brute strength to earn money, which gives equal opportunities to women to protect and provide her own self freeing men of the unnecessary burden and obligation. However, our mind is so closed that we still want to carry those baggage of obligation toward women, which these feminists are cashing in on to extract legal powers to enslave men and violate our rights.

If anybody is empowering these feminists to bring in such draconian lopsided laws it is us. We men are willingly carrying this unnecessary obligation toward women and the society is not worried that this mentality is creating more problems. And feminists have worked up so hard to de-sensitize the society toward men that men have virtually become non-existent. There are now no men; there are only women and another human species which should not be considered more than a sperm bank, money-making machine and a sex slave. Men's identity is lost, thanks to men who have allowed this to happen because we are blinded by our nonsensical sentiments toward women. Who we are? We don't know. We are living our life as per these feminist's idea of a society where women rule everything and still should be called a weaker/fair gender, and men should carry all responsibility, obligation and blame, and this society be called male-dominated society. Only an uneducated retarded moron will not understand this conspiracy of these bi-sexual feminists.

It is high time we men find our self, our true identity, our goal of life. Do we want to live like slaves to feminists? Apparently, most of us are living like slaves and are oblivion of this fact because they still bloody think that protecting and providing women is their bloody business. And because of these handful of morons, majority of nice guys are suffering. We have to shed our outdated mentality. We have to look at our self afresh; where do we stand in our society? We have no legal protection, no legal rights, no social support or anything; we are getting falsely accused/convicted and still we hear that women need more rights in this male-dominated society. Who the hell will not understand this dirty politics played by feminists to destroy men and social balance?

We have two choices, either we continue to carry this filthy mentality of protecting-and-providing-women-is-men's-business and live like a slave hearing about male-dominated society or break free from this perception and see what we individually can do and want to do in our life. Let us realise our dreams and establish our identity in this female-dominated society. We have been already observing insensitiveness toward women but that is not enough. We need to speak out. We need to help out other suffering men. We need to slap these media people for aiding feminists in their conspiracy. And if need be, stop getting married. Sooner or latter, married men will realise that they are married to a merciless dictator called wife and if they don't follow her orders, they will be convicted of mental cruelty.

Come on guys, Let's end this problem once and for all. Don't keep quiet. Discuss amongst friends, colleagues and relatives to protect yourself from this tyranny called women empowerment.

Sat Apr 07, 05:46:00 PM GMT+5:30  
Blogger Dipak said...

Dipak

The indian law are always painful if used falsely. The usages of law by women is being used very falsely to control husband and his money. People are making fun out of it. 498A and so called DV act are social abuse. Due to these laws many families will be destructed. There is no Law which can give relief to innocent people.
Make Law, Break Family. This is the motto of NCW. No one could stop these nonsense. Still fight for good.

Sat Apr 07, 07:00:00 PM GMT+5:30  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Great article , much impressed ..........i am a victim of these laws for the past 4 years.

Sat Apr 07, 08:07:00 PM GMT+5:30  
Anonymous Michael T said...

Rebel has made some good points especially "And if need be, stop getting married".

Men do have power and it is the power to withdraw from relationship. It is natural for men and women to want to live in an intimate relationship with a member of the opposite sex but it is also natural for men and women to want justice and peace in their relationships. Men have to make a choice about which of these two states is more important to them. I think justice and peace are more important than any relationship.

Men should withdraw from relationships where the woman or her advocates are acting unjustly or aggressively towards them. Then women will have to choose between their aggression and injustice and a relationship with a man. Their nature propels them towards men just as much as our nature propels us toward women. At the moment they do not have to choose because they have manipulated society into thinking that men are essentially flawed and at the same time they still have the benefits of relationships with men. They have control of the legal system and the politicians to make everything work in their favor and men continue to enter into intimate relationships with them despite this imbalance.

We may not be able to control the media or the courts or the politicians but we can control ourselves. We are free to choose our own relationships and if we enter into those relationships under the present unjust system then we have no one to blame but ourselves.

Whenever we see injustice or aggression in our relationships we should withdraw to an appropriate extent in order to protect ourselves. Then the perpetrator can decide for themselves which is more important - the relationship or the power they have to hurt us.

Sun Apr 08, 06:34:00 AM GMT+5:30  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Excellent article!

UC

Sun Apr 08, 07:17:00 AM GMT+5:30  
Blogger Advaita Vedanta said...

I agree, Men should withdraw from relationships including marriage if a situation like this arises. I can soon see an impending time will soon arise when marriage will no longer exist as a social institution. Indian Society is heading towards the doom of marriage.

Mon Aug 20, 08:36:00 PM GMT+5:30  
Blogger Preeti said...

well! being a girl with an equal earning capacity as her husband I do have comments to make...
Indian law is surely biased towards men... it tend to undermine the girl's potential to earn and her sacrifices for her husband and kids... if she's the educated or worse still, earning kinds, she's left in a state of financial ruin whereas it does not affect the husband...maybe not consiously but subconsciously every man knows this and tries to force what seems 'right' to them...
What right do they have to ask the girl to stay with her parents and leave her parents? is it because they are not earning? if they are-will it be vice versa?
Coming to the point, in this system which is already so biased, if you have something setup for the protection of males, they are likely to misuse it even more, and in 99% of the cases the girl would not have wnough exposure to counteract it.
In US, many states have community property laws which divides any marital property into equal parts in case of separation....can Indian males accept it who think that by earning, they are the only contributing partners to the family...
If such a law exists, I definitely agree for the protection of both genders.

Thu Oct 18, 12:12:00 PM GMT+5:30  
Blogger Preeti said...

and yes... if you want to adopt a child- the law asks about how you will pay for a girl's marriage- what bloody shit is that... why should one party bear the burden alone? so decide- u cannot have the cake and eat it too...

Thu Oct 18, 12:15:00 PM GMT+5:30  
Blogger Jinesh Zaveri said...

Thanks preeti for your comments i have answered all your questions below...

well! being a girl with an equal earning capacity as her husband I do have comments to make...

[J]- I would be proud of indian women in india if her tax is equal as her husband.

Indian law is surely biased towards men... it tend to undermine the girl's potential to earn and her sacrifices for her husband and kids...

[J]- Yup indian males are useless they are doing nothing except getting fooled by the tears and busy passing such laws and judgement. That is why they choose a lady prime minister praise Sita mata and Jija Mata and have lessons of Bhikhaiji Cama, Rani Laxmi bai, and have NCW etc etc.

if she's the educated or worse still, earning kinds, she's left in a state of financial ruin whereas it does not affect the husband...maybe not consiously but subconsciously every man knows this and tries to force what seems 'right' to them...

[J]- now educaton for ladies is worst? nooooo, but may be in some cases it is true and that get mileage out of proportion.

What right do they have to ask the girl to stay with her parents and leave her parents? is it because they are not earning? if they are-will it be vice versa?

[J]- what right does a girl have to ask the parents of the boy to get out of the house and put them on streets stranded?

Coming to the point, in this system which is already so biased, if you have something setup for the protection of males, they are likely to misuse it even more, and in 99% of the cases the girl would not have wnough exposure to counteract it.

[J]- come out of feminist cliches and prototypes, that anything male is bad blah blah blah.

In US, many states have community property laws which divides any marital property into equal parts in case of separation....can Indian males accept it who think that by earning, they are the only contributing partners to the family...

[J]- sure if the property of wife is also included in 50% during separation. else its high time that americans should realise that they are being fooled.

If such a law exists, I definitely agree for the protection of both genders.

[J]- no if, no but, and no stree hatt. and what is wrong in protecting both the genders?

and yes... if you want to adopt a child- the law asks about how you will pay for a girl's marriage- what bloody shit is that... why should one party bear the burden alone? so decide- u cannot have the cake and eat it too...

[J]- oh now suddenly the law is bad? btw i will show you equal numbers of cases where the marriage cost is equally divided between the parties.

Sun Oct 21, 09:49:00 PM GMT+5:30  
Blogger gopelalwani said...

"WE ARE NEITHER DOWRY TAKERS NOR DOWRY GIVERS".
" WE ARE ALSO NOT VICTIMS OF DOWRY GIVERS".
"WE ARE THE VICTIMS (BAKRAS) OF CHEATS AND FRAUDSTERS MISUSING 498A AS THEIR PROFESSION.

THE FACT IS THAT WE ARE VICTIMS OF MISUSER'S OF LAW 498A
WE ARE HUNTED BY CRIMINALS AND EXTORTIONIST IN COLLUSION
WITH CORRUPT INDIAN POLICE AND JUDICIAL MACHINERY.

This is the story of my son.
Entire family of US citizens has been named in 498A false prosecution.
Two members of the family were arrested unaware four years ago at Mumbai
Airport and Jailed.
Non- bailable Arrest warrants are still pending against other members of family.

The match-making leading to the proposal to marry, and engagement taking place was fixed on the traditional considerations of Cast, Religion, Education, Social standing in society, Financial status, Earning capacity,Bank balances & properties held by both professionals including compatibility, Height Weight, Complexion etc;

The girl desired to marry in USA as She did not expect decent marriage in India due to her broken family background and social stigma attached to her 'divorced mother' in Indian society.

TWO DAYS BEFORE LEAVING INDIA TO MARRY IN USA, THE GIRL
TRANSFERRED ALL HER ASSETS,BANK BALANCES AND PROPERTIES TO HER MOTHER BY EXECUTING SPECIAL POWER OF ATTORNEY.

GIRL IS LAWYER HERSELF.
SHE HAS STATED AND CONFIRMED IN THE PRENUPTIAL AGREEMENT EXECUTED BEFORE HER MARRIAGE IN USA; THAT HER ALL HER ASSETS AND BELONGINGS WERE IN INDIA AND SHE HAD NOTHING VALUABLE AS SHE DID NOT BRING ANY THING IN USA.

WHILE IN USA SHE SWINDLED AND TRIED TO TAKE OVER THE HUSBAND'S ASSETS BUT WAS FINALLY DIVORCED WITHIN
SIX MONTHS.

PROFESSIONALS SHOULD BE WARNED ABOUT FRAUDULENT MARRIAGES AND CAUTIONED ACCORDINGLY.

Mon Oct 22, 12:46:00 AM GMT+5:30  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"WE ARE NEITHER DOWRY TAKERS NOR DOWRY GIVERS".
" WE ARE ALSO NOT VICTIMS OF DOWRY GIVERS".
"WE ARE THE VICTIMS (BAKRAS) OF CHEATS AND FRAUDSTERS MISUSING 498A AS THEIR PROFESSION.

THE FACT IS THAT WE ARE VICTIMS OF MISUSER'S OF LAW 498A
WE ARE HUNTED BY CRIMINALS AND EXTORTIONIST IN COLLUSION
WITH CORRUPT INDIAN POLICE AND JUDICIAL MACHINERY.

This is the story of my son.
Entire family of US citizens has been named in 498A false prosecution.
Two members of the family were arrested unaware four years ago at Mumbai
Airport and Jailed.
Non- bailable Arrest warrants are still pending against other members of family.

The match-making leading to the proposal to marry, and engagement taking place was fixed on the traditional considerations of Cast, Religion, Education, Social standing in society, Financial status, Earning capacity,Bank balances & properties held by both professionals including compatibility, Height Weight, Complexion etc;

The girl desired to marry in USA as She did not expect decent marriage in India due to her broken family background and social stigma attached to her 'divorced mother' in Indian society.

TWO DAYS BEFORE LEAVING INDIA TO MARRY IN USA, THE GIRL
TRANSFERRED ALL HER ASSETS,BANK BALANCES AND PROPERTIES TO HER MOTHER BY EXECUTING SPECIAL POWER OF ATTORNEY.

GIRL IS LAWYER HERSELF.
SHE HAS STATED AND CONFIRMED IN THE PRENUPTIAL AGREEMENT EXECUTED BEFORE HER MARRIAGE IN USA; THAT HER ALL HER ASSETS AND BELONGINGS WERE IN INDIA AND SHE HAD NOTHING VALUABLE AS SHE DID NOT BRING ANY THING IN USA.

WHILE IN USA SHE SWINDLED AND TRIED TO TAKE OVER THE HUSBAND'S ASSETS BUT WAS FINALLY DIVORCED WITHIN
SIX MONTHS.

PROFESSIONALS SHOULD BE WARNED ABOUT FRAUDULENT MARRIAGES AND CAUTIONED ACCORDINGLY.

Mon Oct 22, 12:49:00 AM GMT+5:30  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

well! being a girl with an equal earning capacity as her husband I do have comments to make...

[K] - Waw, woman remember that they are earning now, sounds really kewl. What about those times when we men used to risk our like and hunt for food in the wild. or what about those times when ONLY men used to earn, and you woman were still fed? you still got those gold jewelery?

I hope now when you are earning you must be buying gold for your hubby too? do you?


[P]Indian law is surely biased towards men...

[K] - Oh yeah, do you know WOMAN pay less tax than MAN? Do you know there are WOMAN ONLY laws but there is NO MAN ONLY law in men's favour?

[P}it tend to undermine the girl's potential to earn and her sacrifices for her husband and kids...

[K} - Gals sacrifices, what a joke....so just by leaving paternal family you think a gal is making a scarifies?

Do you know WE the MAN still marry a gal even if she is NOT earning, we MEN still
take care of wife even if she is NOT earning, we MEN buy her jewelery even if she is NOT earning.

common dear its your turn to talk about WOMAN, please let me know if you WOMAN would like to marry a guy who is not earning?

If your answer is yes, then I am ready to leave my job and marry such a gal who want to earn for me. I would really hope that you can find atleast one such woman on this planet.


[P]if she's the educated or worse still, earning kinds, she's left in a state of financial ruin whereas it does not affect the husband...

[K]- You are right, if she is educated then she is worse, Woman are born innocent, its the education that ruins them.

Also you are right when you said its worst when they are earning.

So again like indian courts you are also assuming that it does not affect the MAN financially, so you also believe in alimony ( Pension to Prostitute).

[P] - maybe not consiously but subconsciously every man knows this and tries to force what seems 'right' to them...

[K} - What a joke, its woman who always try to force their ideas to MAN, woman go upto such stoop level that they even deny sex to husband if they want to get something. also those tears that are waiting to come out are always a BRAHMA_ASTRA.

[P] -What right do they have to ask the girl to stay with her parents and leave her parents? is it because they are not earning?

[K] - find a gal who is earning five times more than me, is ready to buy a house for me, is ready to buy gold jewelry for me on my b'day and marriage aniv,

I assure you that I will cook for her, I will stay with her in her house, I wont mind her parents also staying with us.

Can you find a gal?

ha ha ha... if not then SHUT UP.

[P] - if they are-will it be vice versa? Coming to the point, in this system which is already so biased, if you have something setup for the protection of males, they are likely to misuse it even more, and in 99% of the cases the girl would not have wnough exposure to counteract it.

[K] - :-)

In US, many states have community property laws which divides any marital property into equal parts in case of separation....can Indian males accept it who think that by earning, they are the only contributing partners to the family...

[K} - 1. so you think US treats woman fairly? you are thinking just based on your own ideas about US. do you know just because of that so called freedom to woman, woman here are treated like dirt?

Do you when woman want to have SEX they usually go to a BAR and look for a mate? you might not be knowing the bad part of it, but you always want to see that the property is divided equally.

2.Do you really know how many single mothers are there in US?

Do you know how difficult it is for a single mother to take care of kids and then earn for the family?

Preeti ji, when we MEN of India have taken that responsibility of earning for family still you are trying to find a fault there?

Okey, now let me challenge you, We men always earn for family, please try to make a similar statement from woman side. as far as I know woman always earn for themselves, very rarely for a family.

3. Let me come to Indian scenario, WOMAN want 50% share in the property, then they shud bring in 50% of their share from father's property when they get married.

oh yeah... but you will be happy to call that share of property as DOWRY, and when there is seperation you WOMAN want to take back that so called DOWRY as STREE DHUN. on top of that you want 50% share in property, and then ALIMONY ( Pension to Prostitute).

We MEN are ready for 50% share, but I hope you would be able to convince your WOMAN folks to bring in their share when they get married.


[P] -If such a law exists, I definitely agree for the protection of both genders.

[K] - I am assuming and thanking GOD that you are not a judge in indian courts, otherwise you would be unnecessarily punishing indian MEN just because of your views. and in doing so you would have protected your own kind.

[P] - and yes... if you want to adopt a child- the law asks about how you will pay for a girl's marriage- what bloody shit is that... why should one party bear the burden alone? so decide- u cannot have the cake and eat it too...

[K] - Hey don't change sides, be on one side, either the law is good for woman or its not. I stick to the point that its biased in favor of woman.

I dont know about other communities, but in my community we dont ask any share for expenses for marriage from gal's side.

Any ways, I told my mom that I dont care about such rules, I would surely ask for 50% share of marriage expenses, as it would be her marriage too :D, Preeti ji, I know there ia at least one person to support my decision, and I thank you from bottom of my heart for that. :-)

And I hope you will stick to your words and wont change your views on this now.

[P]-u cannot have the cake and eat it too...

[K} - How can I avoid my favorite CAKE here now.

Mam, for once you curse entire mankind (you may wanna fight on this as well why we dont use WOMANKIND) and on other hand you wanna keep the biased laws as well... and on top of that you again say that laws are biased in favr of MEN.

Are you sure you are not suffering from BPD?

Mon Oct 22, 03:24:00 AM GMT+5:30  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Preeti Ji,
You have already shown your hatred to boy's parents. You say, doing unjustice to men and their parents is justified because you "*** SUSPECT **", females will be at the receiving end if they dont misuse these laws.
That is Barbaric. No civilized society has laws which say "Guilty until proven". And plz dont talk about females. More than 70% 498A, Dowry laws are misused against females ( Mother In Law, sister In Law, Sister of husband, girl children in boys family).
Supreme court has already termed misusers of these laws as "Legal Terrorists".
Your point to favor laws is no good than "Talibaan-run-state" laws.
Please dont talk about females, you live for yourself.

Mon Oct 22, 09:50:00 AM GMT+5:30  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Preeti is saying - "Indian law is surely biased towards men". I do not know whether her sense of humour is good or my english is bad.

Indian laws are surely biased AGAINST Indian men. Look at 498a - the wife files a police complaint to settle any disputes and the whole family of husband is arrested. Look at adultery laws, if men commit adultery then they are criminals but if women commit adultery, they are just victims!

"And here we have a lady saying Inidan law is biased towards men"

Mon Oct 22, 04:49:00 PM GMT+5:30  
Blogger Preeti said...

Hi Jinesh,

I can see that you are bitter...let me try to explain it in a better way as your comments...

[J]- I would be proud of indian women in india if her tax is equal as her husband.

Do you know the difference? Its Rs.5000 lesser in income taxes... if this is the debate point- I agree with you...I am NOT for reservations of ANY kind, not even based on religion and caste...In fact, it kind of propagates the idea of the 'weaker' sex...


[J]- Yup indian males are useless they are doing nothing except getting fooled by the tears and busy passing such laws and judgement. That is why they choose a lady prime minister praise Sita mata and Jija Mata and have lessons of Bhikhaiji Cama, Rani Laxmi bai, and have NCW etc etc.

Objection please!!! How many men with earning wives have left their jobs to look after kids and home? and what do you mean MEN pass laws and elect lady PM...we are talking about a country where 57% of its population is women...now THIS is a bias...one lady pm...how many men???1 laxmi bai...tipu sultan,shivaji,prithviraj chauhan... doesnt the proportion tell you something? the few examples just show that they are capable of it but cannot or dont do it...


[J]- now educaton for ladies is worst? nooooo, but may be in some cases it is true and that get mileage out of proportion.

no- education is a must but I have never seen a situation where an educated lady gets her part...not even her own earning because HER earnings are used to run the house..its spent and the guys earnings for getting property in the guys name...

[J]- what right does a girl have to ask the parents of the boy to get out of the house and put them on streets stranded?

Why on streets, don't parents have their own ho me...or they dont buy it thin king they'll stay with their 'son'. Why not the girl's parents- they can go on streets- right? after they are bankrupt from a girl's marriage only ( mind it, only the function and no dowry as you say)

[J]- come out of feminist cliches and prototypes, that anything male is bad blah blah blah.

Oh no... sorry to say sir- you have not proved a thing...
you just have demands from your wife and nothing to give in turn...

and a wife is a life partner-treat her with foremost importance- more than your parents,career and money and such laws will not be required...

[J]- sure if the property of wife is also included in 50% during separation. else its high time that americans should realise that they are being fooled.

Yes, property of both husband and wife acquired 'after' marriage and 'before separation' is considered...no mattered who earned and who sacrificed...and no... America is a truly developed nation in all sense...and not by disrespecting its women... there are men who are not in as good jobs as their wives who become 'stay at home' dads...and no parents go on streets because they plan never to interfere in the girls or boys life...unlike what we beleive in India, they very much respect their parents and parents very much take care of their ids and in better ways...


[J]- no if, no but, and no stree hatt. and what is wrong in protecting both the genders?

Of course there is an if, there is a but- laws are based on contexts and not asolute...and it should also change with time according to contexts...if no ifs and buts are considered then laws should never never change...

ok...tell me one thing...if you have no dowry or gifts for the girl with you you are not impotent (shown by medical results), you have not physically abused your wife(proved medically),
do not have any extra marital affair, how can your wife implicate you...and just 1 more careless thought- if all your bank accounts are in her name too- wont it be all the more difficult?

[J]- oh now suddenly the law is bad? btw i will show you equal numbers of cases where the marriage cost is equally divided between the parties.

I did not know it existed but if so I;m truly happy for my nation and yes, if this is really true , then in such cases women also do not need any protection...

Mon Oct 22, 10:23:00 PM GMT+5:30  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Indian Racket of Marriage Frauds under cover of Section 498A IPC.

We are neither dowry takers nor dowry givers.
We are also not the victims of dowry givers.
We are victims of non-dowry givers, who are swindlers and extortionists.
We are the victims ( Bakra ) of cheats and fraudsters misusing weapon 498A.

WE ARE HUNTED BY CRIMINALS AND EXTORTIONIST
IN COLLUSION WITH CORRUPT INDIAN POLICE AND
JUDICIAL MACHINERY.

This is the story of my son.
Entire family of US citizens has been named in 498A false prosecution.
Two members of the family were arrested unaware four years ago at
Mumbai Airport and Jailed. Non- bailable Arrest warrants are still
pending against rest of the members of the US citizen's family.

The match-making leading to the proposal to marry, and engagement taking place was fixed on the traditional considerations of Cast, Religion, Education, Social standing in society, Financial status, Earning capacity,Bank balances & properties held by both professionals including compatibility, Height Weight, Complexion etc;

The girl desired to marry in USA as She did not expect decent marriage in India due to her broken family background and social stigma attached to her 'divorced mother' in Indian society.

Two days before leaving India for USA, she transferred all her assets, properties and bank accounts to her mother by executing special power of attorney.


She, who is lawyer herself has stated and confirmed in the prenuptial agreement executed by her on 6-2-2002 before her marriage took place
in USA on 13-2-2002; that all her assets and belongings were lying in India, and she had brought nothing in USA. As such she had no valuable in USA to declare in the said prenuptial agreement

While in USA she swindled and tried to take over husband's assets
but was finally divorced within one year of her marriage.

Mon Oct 22, 10:40:00 PM GMT+5:30  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Indian Racket of Marriage Frauds under cover of Section 498A IPC.

We are neither dowry takers nor dowry givers.
We are also not the victims of dowry givers.
We are victims of non-dowry givers, who are swindlers and extortionists.
We are the victims ( Bakra ) of cheats and fraudsters misusing weapon 498A.

WE ARE HUNTED BY CRIMINALS AND EXTORTIONIST
IN COLLUSION WITH CORRUPT INDIAN POLICE AND
JUDICIAL MACHINERY.

This is the story of my son.
Entire family of US citizens has been named in 498A false prosecution.
Two members of the family were arrested unaware four years ago at
Mumbai Airport and Jailed. Non- bailable Arrest warrants are still
pending against rest of the members of the US citizen's family.

The match-making leading to the proposal to marry, and engagement taking place was fixed on the traditional considerations of Cast, Religion, Education, Social standing in society, Financial status, Earning capacity,Bank balances & properties held by both professionals including compatibility, Height Weight, Complexion etc;

The girl desired to marry in USA as She did not expect decent marriage in India due to her broken family background and social stigma attached to her 'divorced mother' in Indian society.

Two days before leaving India for USA, she transferred all her assets, properties and bank accounts to her mother by executing special power of attorney.


She, who is lawyer herself has stated and confirmed in the prenuptial agreement executed by her on 6-2-2002 before her marriage took place
in USA on 13-2-2002; that all her assets and belongings were lying in India, and she had brought nothing in USA. As such she had no valuable in USA to declare in the said prenuptial agreement

While in USA she swindled and tried to take over husband's assets
but was finally divorced within one year of her marriage.

Mon Oct 22, 10:42:00 PM GMT+5:30  
Blogger Jinesh Zaveri said...

Hi Preeti, Welcome Back,

Actually I noticed that you were quite bitter so may be that got on to me. Thanks for correcting that though.

Ok on the discussion part...

Do you know the difference? Its Rs.5000 lesser in income taxes... if this is the debate point- I agree with you...I am NOT for reservations of ANY kind, not even based on religion and caste...In fact, it kind of propagates the idea of the 'weaker' sex...

[J]-Thanks for agreeing. That is what we too mean.

Objection please!!! How many men with earning wives have left their jobs to look after kids and home? and what do you mean MEN pass laws and elect lady PM...we are talking about a country where 57% of its population is women...now THIS is a bias...one lady pm...how many men???1 laxmi bai...tipu sultan,shivaji,prithviraj chauhan... doesnt the proportion tell you something? the few examples just show that they are capable of it but cannot or dont do it...

[J]- Objection Sustained. naaa, But You mean men don't pass these laws, that means men do not have that right too? anyway, Thanks for agreeing to what we are telling since long that india is not male dominated in numbers it is indeed the real powerful sex called women who dominate the population by 57%. And we fully support this fact and we are happy about this. on those leaders i can give long list of women contribution as well. and lets be proud of it. they have done it without any handicap. unlike these days.

no- education is a must but I have never seen a situation where an educated lady gets her part...not even her own earning because HER earnings are used to run the house..its spent and the guys earnings for getting property in the guys name...

[J] welcome to the SOHO and small scale industry segment in india majority of the profit making business is run in the name of women who pay salaries to their husbands for working under them. all in black and white. btw this is the largest segment in Indian Economy. I will also show you sooooo many cases where the flat is in the name of the lady and the husband is not a party to it. more over it is a gift given to the wife by the hubby.

Why on streets, don't parents have their own ho me...or they dont buy it thin king they'll stay with their 'son'. Why not the girl's parents- they can go on streets- right? after they are bankrupt from a girl's marriage only ( mind it, only the function and no dowry as you say)

[J] these days the girls parents are staying at the home of the husbands flat filed a false DV on the husbands family and have driven them out of the house. I personally have counseled 2 such families.

Oh no... sorry to say sir- you have not proved a thing...
you just have demands from your wife and nothing to give in turn...

and a wife is a life partner-treat her with foremost importance- more than your parents,career and money and such laws will not be required...

[J] I repeat Pls come out of feminist cleches and prototypes.

Yes, property of both husband and wife acquired 'after' marriage and 'before separation' is considered...no mattered who earned and who sacrificed...and no... America is a truly developed nation in all sense...and not by disrespecting its women... there are men who are not in as good jobs as their wives who become 'stay at home' dads...and no parents go on streets because they plan never to interfere in the girls or boys life...unlike what we beleive in India, they very much respect their parents and parents very much take care of their ids and in better ways...

[J]- It is a well known fact that in India the state of parents is really bad which also has large chunck of parents of male child, telecasted on a zindagi live some days back. and yet there are no laws to protect the parents. these parents took good care of their parents too as well as kids and they too expect the same, nothing wrong. yes where as in US my friend there acknowledge the fact that they are separated much before. which is un-indian.

ok...tell me one thing...if you have no dowry or gifts for the girl with you you are not impotent (shown by medical results), you have not physically abused your wife(proved medically),
do not have any extra marital affair, how can your wife implicate you...and just 1 more careless thought- if all your bank accounts are in her name too- wont it be all the more difficult?

[J]- Thanks for the concern, I too had this question once upon a time and every ethical person would have this question. and only such people would have the courage to fight back coz the culprits are smart. I have written a blog of 60+ articles on your question. And you may click on any blogs to find the answer. if you do not get the answer pls give me your mail ID I will send loads of information to you. If you have a brother in India then you would be able to relate to this. So I would await an answer from you on this may be a personal mail would do.

I did not know it existed but if so I;m truly happy for my nation and yes, if this is really true , then in such cases women also do not need any protection...

[J] thank you for agreeing to this fact. while you say that women do not need protection i would say both men and women need protection being good humans from evil humans.

God Bless You.

Tue Oct 23, 12:03:00 AM GMT+5:30  
Blogger Preeti said...

Thanks for the clarifications Jinesh...it leaves me less bitter...
actually I am a girl who earns and contributes equally in the household... however my husband has taken all joint assets (paid by both of us) in his name on some trivial isues like- car in his name because I did not have a DL when we took the car...whenI ell him that the house we are planning to book should be in joint name he says "we'll see".
Now he and his parents have started telling me that I should not financially help my parents (even with my own earned money apart from the household contribution) and only think of them as my new family. When I refuse to contribute to household expenditure on such issues my husband says directly that he'll divorce me if I stop paying up.
Moreover, he demands me to compromise my career too, so I can stay more at home and he can bring over his parents. (he wants me tohave a job but not a career)

All this left me bitter and I saw no law protecting me and the assets that I paid for with my own earning too.
I realized the hell I will be going through if I get divorced and my sympathies went to all girls who cannot protect themselves. I am in an ideal situation and yet helpless...what about girls who are in not such ideal position...whose parents actually pay so much for a secure future and her husband just has expectations from her which he can easily get from a household help...Only the household help can quit!!

and yes I accept I probably got a bit biased thinking of myself and equality.... and even now I cannot beleive it easily that any girl would herself want money over family life...

Tue Oct 23, 08:28:00 AM GMT+5:30  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

and yes...the point of all this is that since the only law I can find is 498a for any protection, I was thinking of using it(my in laws had forcibly kept many gifts during muh dikhayee and all and it did not matter).... to teach them what is right...not any longer...they will never learn and I will not tarnish my conscience..I will do as is lawfully right...

Tue Oct 23, 10:49:00 AM GMT+5:30  
Blogger Preeti said...

hey anonymous- sorry did not answer your questions...for sure you are at the receiving end too...I apologise for thinking just about girls when I should be thinking about people at the receiving end...

here are my comments:-

Anonymous said...
[K] - Waw, woman remember that they are earning now, sounds really kewl. What about those times when we men used to risk our like and hunt for food in the wild. or what about those times when ONLY men used to earn, and you woman were still fed? you still got those gold jewelery?

ARE WE DISCUSSING THOSE TIMES??ARE WE GOING BACK A STEP IN EVOLUTION?? do you hunt?live in caves? so lets not talk about the 'good old days'

I hope now when you are earning you must be buying gold for your hubby too? do you?

No- but I did buy him a car and going to buy him a house for his parents to live.... girl's parents are not accepted in such a house...
and yes...he has never NEVER bought me ANY gold despite this....
This is just to answer your question here which is damn personal....

[K] - Oh yeah, do you know WOMAN pay less tax than MAN? Do you know there are WOMAN ONLY laws but there is NO MAN ONLY law in men's favour?

did you also know that there is no law for upper castes in society or for hindu nationals? yet the society is biased- right?
(personally speaking...yes tax is one thing I do not support differentiation in...it was made because there was no equal pay in jbs and should have been abolished once that came into play)


[K} - Gals sacrifices, what a joke....so just by leaving paternal family you think a gal is making a sacrifies?

Of course- try leaving your paternal family FOR your wife and then tell me if ...and sacrifice- well- learn from your mother...your wife is also going to be someone's mother and its an inherent quality...

Do you know WE the MAN still marry a gal even if she is NOT earning, we MEN still
take care of wife even if she is NOT earning, we MEN buy her jewelery even if she is NOT earning.

oh no sir- thats not always the case...and you marry her when she is NOT earnig to care of your house...and take care of her- more than you would to your mom and dad? or is it charity...
Moreover, its a choice YOU have...you marry a girl when is not working for your needs and marry her if she's working for her money...actually if you are so self sufficient- why marry at all?? because you know its not true...

common dear its your turn to talk about WOMAN, please let me know if you WOMAN would like to marry a guy who is not earning?

at least they are clear- and given the lack of options that guys have (they would marry a working woman given the chance), if someday the stereotype is changed, its very much possible and does happen in western societies...

If your answer is yes, then I am ready to leave my job and marry such a gal who want to earn for me. I would really hope that you can find atleast one such woman on this planet.

yes... but you have to be hansome (sundar), never speak when spoken to, stay with your in laws, work like a housemaid and if your future wife takes to alcoholism, support her too....and yes, not to forget a slap or two when she loses patience with you....

[K]- You are right, if she is educated then she is worse, Woman are born innocent, its the education that ruins them.

No sir- i said her condition is worse, she is not worse. And no- education just empowers them to stand against people like you for they believe is right and fair...
for that matter- education is the solution for all social problems...for both the sexes...

Also you are right when you said its worst when they are earning.

Yes- because then you know they can stand on their own feet and you cannot DEMAND things from her...

So again like indian courts you are also assuming that it does not affect the MAN financially, so you also believe in alimony ( Pension to Prostitute).

No no... I dont beleive at all in alimony- its too less... she deserves at least half of all your earnings after marriage and before separation....

[K} - What a joke, its woman who always try to force their ideas to MAN, woman go upto such stoop level that they even deny sex to husband if they want to get something. also those tears that are waiting to come out are always a BRAHMA_ASTRA.

you dont seem like a person who would move with tears...and btw- its a stereotype that disallows men to cry....sex and stoop level...if you dont know the basics of sex that it sould be with both partners willingness than its lust and marriages dont run on lust...both partners have equal right to say 'no' when they are stressed or tired...

[K] - find a gal who is earning five times more than me, is ready to buy a house for me, is ready to buy gold jewelry for me on my b'day and marriage aniv,

so if a husband is not earning 5 times as much as a girl, does not buy the house in the girl's name, does not buy her jeweleray, then he has no right to keep his parents with him??? get your mind clear first dude....
all I'm saying is that both sets of parents are important and even a girl's parents have the right to stay with her whether or not she is earning and the same goes for guys....

I assure you that I will cook for her, I will stay with her in her house, I wont mind her parents also staying with us.

Gr8....better said than done....try it!!

Can you find a gal?
its difficult in today's society but not impossible...that what I;m aiming at- a society where you CAN find such girls....and THEn and only THEN you should talk about protection...

ha ha ha... if not then SHUT UP.
oh no- that just proves my point...

[K} - 1. so you think US treats woman fairly? you are thinking just based on your own ideas about US. do you know just because of that so called freedom to woman, woman here are treated like dirt?

No sir- thats a pre concieved notion coming from mislead articles...like the people outside beleive about India...I stay here, work here and not seen anything like it...not like India in any case...

Do you when woman want to have SEX they usually go to a BAR and look for a mate?

so its a male prepogative...not all women go as not all men go in India...

you might not be knowing the bad part of it, but you always want to see that the property is divided equally.

Yes, property is the only tangible thing...which can be measured...

2.Do you really know how many single mothers are there in US?

Thats good...they would rather stay alone than take a lifetime of torture

Do you know how difficult it is for a single mother to take care of kids and then earn for the family?

Yes it is- and to think that they do it- imagine the pain they must be in while living with her husband which is greater than this pain....they choose the lesser pain...and can live happily after that...
but families that d work are truly happy....no-one compromises for any other resson but love...

Preeti ji, when we MEN of India have taken that responsibility of earning for family still you are trying to find a fault there?

Thats not what women want.... many like me will gladly take the so called 'responsibility' in return for having the demands that you have of your wives...

Okey, now let me challenge you, We men always earn for family, please try to make a similar statement from woman side. as far as I know woman always earn for themselves, very rarely for a family.

Really!!! You MUST have had the wrong partner...and yes- family for me includes everyone...what is a 'family' to you? guys parents, girl and guy??

3. Let me come to Indian scenario, WOMAN want 50% share in the property, then they shud bring in 50% of their share from father's property when they get married.

No they dont... nobody I know does unless they are asked to bring big dowries....and truly at least I cant trust a guy who has to have share in his parent's property and cannot build up something of their own ... but yes, if they contributr (after marriage) in such a property I guess i make my point....

oh yeah... but you will be happy to call that share of property as DOWRY, and when there is seperation you WOMAN want to take back that so called DOWRY as STREE DHUN. on top of that you want 50% share in property, and then ALIMONY ( Pension to Prostitute).

STREE dhan is gifts given to the girl in her marriage...and gifts are a separate matter- if she or anyone gives you any gift- she canot ask for it....
share in property is a small thing- u promise her your 100% life- u fail, but what about the long hours she waited (even when not cooking and cleaning) while you earn? I think she deserves every part of it...or if she's earning as i said- 50% of ALL acquired property...

We MEN are ready for 50% share, but I hope you would be able to convince your WOMAN folks to bring in their share when they get married.

50% share of your father's property??? what are you talking about?? I;m strictly talking about money and property from both sides earned after marriage and before separation...

[K] - I am assuming and thanking GOD that you are not a judge in indian courts, otherwise you would be unnecessarily punishing indian MEN just because of your views. and in doing so you would have protected your own kind.

I would have suggested more psychological treatments and removal of stereotypes in both sexes before breaking a marriage...

I dont know about other communities, but in my community we dont ask any share for expenses for marriage from gal's side.

If this is really so...I WILL gladly apologise to you....my harsh words are only meant for stereotypes and had NEVER found such a community in India...I belong to a place where marriage expenses are 'NOT dowry'...gifts to be given to ALL and sundry is 'not dowry'... and girls have to give their streedhan to be kept in their in-laws locker...I AM bitter


Any ways, I told my mom that I dont care about such rules, I would surely ask for 50% share of marriage expenses, as it would be her marriage too :D, Preeti ji, I know there ia at least one person to support my decision, and I thank you from bottom of my heart for that. :-)

Yes I ABSOLUTELY SUPPORT YOU THERE...

And I hope you will stick to your words and wont change your views on this now.

frankly speaking- its been a good vent to let out my feelings as well

[K} - How can I avoid my favorite CAKE here now.

:-)

Mam, for once you curse entire mankind (you may wanna fight on this as well why we dont use WOMANKIND) and on other hand you wanna keep the biased laws as well... and on top of that you again say that laws are biased in favr of MEN.

Are you sure you are not suffering from BPD?

BPD???

maybe not sure but I definitely feel lighter...

Tue Oct 23, 12:35:00 PM GMT+5:30  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Somehow I notice logical argumenets and reasoning coming from Preeti, whereaes offended almost abusive language coming from the replier. I notice the Indian male still thinks bombastic talk, bravado and abusive/ pushiness means that they are smart (?). Probably that is the reason why these women empowering laws have come about merely to provide some arsenel to the woman. Do not get me wrong. I am a man who has been / is being hounded by an unscruplous (i really doubt her sanity now) woman with no regard to even my child's welfare or eqal access to me, purely to use him extract maximum from me. These DV acts etc are coming in very handy to her. Here eventhough I am the exploited party I find myself helpless to take any legal action. Merely to stop harassing me she seeks half of my hard earned estate, No share in the upkeep/ custody of my son. She does not earn and now she wants to stay in my house and I need to move out to a one room tenetment. It is all very unfair. She has never bothered about the stresses, strains, risk to health that I necessarily need to take to earn apart from demanding total freedom to spend. What would Preeti advise in a case like mine ? Should I give it all and than like the "ATM machine" i feel i am for my wife. Or fight a losing / hard battle in court which is very biased towards woman (for more reasons than one)and lose most if not all my hard earned for the lawyers and courts. In all this stress and hopelessness I am still supposed to earn and provide ( and not my wife) who can stay at home and 'manage' the house. How I wish I could switch roles. Its a horrible helpless bind for men caught in a situation such as mine.

Thu Dec 31, 10:09:00 AM GMT+5:30  

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